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Pay a toll to avoid traffic

Metro officials examining tolls to pay for new Interstate 5 carpool lanes

Posted: February 22, 2013 2:00 a.m.
Updated: February 22, 2013 2:00 a.m.

 

Facing a $100 million funding gap and potentially decades of construction, county transportation officials are exploring the possibility of using per-mile tolls to fund two new carpool lanes on Interstate 5 in the Santa Clarita Valley.

Doing so will both speed up completion and ensure the financial viability of the project, proponents say.

As part of the ongoing effort to expand I-5 traffic capacity, the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority is planning to add two 13.5-mile carpool lanes from Parker Road in Castaic to the junction with Highway 14 in both directions on the freeway.

As it stands, Metro would use funds made available from sales tax dedicated to transit — namely Measure R and Proposition C funds — to construct the new lanes.

Those two funding sources would provide approximately $310 million for the project over the next 27 years, said Chris Margaronis, the project’s manager.

However, the project’s estimated cost is $410 million.

To shorten the construction window, Metro officials are considering a partnership with a private entity to bankroll and construct the project, Margaronis said.

The private investment would then be paid back by making the new carpool lanes into toll lanes. This, combined with Measure R and Proposition C funds, would be sufficient to pay the private firm, Margaronis said.

Immediate private funding could also ensure the project’s completion by as soon as 2019, Metro officials said during a Signal Editorial Board meeting on Wednesday.

Lan Saadatnejadi, executive officer of Metro’s highway program, estimated toll revenue would account for roughly 20 percent of the project’s total cost.

Saadatnejadi said this would be the first such private-public partnership in Los Angeles County.

“This wasn’t even an option for us until recently,” Saadatnejadi said, citing legislation enacted in 2009. “And we only have a short window, until 2017, that it is available.”

Public-private partnerships became an option when then-Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger signed Senate Bill X2 4 in February 2009. That bill allows regional transportation agencies, as well as the California Department of Transportation, to enter into an unlimited number of public-private partnerships until Jan. 1, 2017.

In addition to immediate capital, the private entity would also be responsible for maintaining the lanes, and Metro could withhold scheduled payments if road conditions became unsatisfactory, Saadatnejadi said.

Victor Lindenheim, executive director of the Golden State Gateway Coalition, said partnerships like these could become more common in the future.

“It’s increasingly necessary to look for creative ways to fund projects,” Lindenheim said. “It will be a different world in a couple of years in terms of how transportation infrastructure is funded.”

It was unclear what the toll would be if the plan moves ahead; a public hearing is necessary to set the rate.

A solo driver would be subject to the per-mile toll at all times.

During peak travel hours, any car with fewer than three people would be subject to the toll.

In return, drivers would have a guarantee that traffic in the toll lanes will not drop below 45 mph, Margaronis said.

Tolls would vary depending on the time of day and traffic. For instance, it would be more expensive to use a toll lane during rush hour than at a non-peak time.

Santa Clarita City Councilwoman Marsha McLean, who represents the city on a number of transportation boards, said she needs more information on the proposal before she decides whether to support it.

“Obviously there is a need to upgrade the I-5 sooner rather than later,” McLean said. “But there are still an awful lot of questions to be answered.”

Metro will hold two public meeting in Santa Clarita next week to collect public comment on the proposal. The first meeting is 6 p.m. Tuesday at the Santa Clarita Sports Complex, 20880 Centre Pointe Parkway, and the second is 6 p.m. on Thursday at Rancho Pico Junior High School, 26520 Valencia Blvd.

Feb. 22, 2013 02:00a.m. EST Pay a toll to avoid traffic The Signal

Facing a $100 million funding gap and potentially decades of construction, county transportation officials are exploring the possibility of using per-mile tolls to fund two new carpool lanes on Interstate 5 in the Santa Clarita Valley.

Doing so will both speed up completion and ensure the financial viability of the project, proponents say.

As part of the ongoing effort to expand I-5 traffic capacity, the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority is planning to add two 13.5-mile carpool lanes from Parker Road in Castaic to the junction with Highway 14 in both directions on the freeway.

As it stands, Metro would use funds made available from sales tax dedicated to transit — namely Measure R and Proposition C funds — to construct the new lanes.

Those two funding sources would provide approximately $310 million for the project over the next 27 years, said Chris Margaronis, the project’s manager.

However, the project’s estimated cost is $410 million.

To shorten the construction window, Metro officials are considering a partnership with a private entity to bankroll and construct the project, Margaronis said.

The private investment would then be paid back by making the new carpool lanes into toll lanes. This, combined with Measure R and Proposition C funds, would be sufficient to pay the private firm, Margaronis said.

Immediate private funding could also ensure the project’s completion by as soon as 2019, Metro officials said during a Signal Editorial Board meeting on Wednesday.

Lan Saadatnejadi, executive officer of Metro’s highway program, estimated toll revenue would account for roughly 20 percent of the project’s total cost.

Saadatnejadi said this would be the first such private-public partnership in Los Angeles County.

“This wasn’t even an option for us until recently,” Saadatnejadi said, citing legislation enacted in 2009. “And we only have a short window, until 2017, that it is available.”

Public-private partnerships became an option when then-Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger signed Senate Bill X2 4 in February 2009. That bill allows regional transportation agencies, as well as the California Department of Transportation, to enter into an unlimited number of public-private partnerships until Jan. 1, 2017.

In addition to immediate capital, the private entity would also be responsible for maintaining the lanes, and Metro could withhold scheduled payments if road conditions became unsatisfactory, Saadatnejadi said.

Victor Lindenheim, executive director of the Golden State Gateway Coalition, said partnerships like these could become more common in the future.

“It’s increasingly necessary to look for creative ways to fund projects,” Lindenheim said. “It will be a different world in a couple of years in terms of how transportation infrastructure is funded.”

It was unclear what the toll would be if the plan moves ahead; a public hearing is necessary to set the rate.

A solo driver would be subject to the per-mile toll at all times.

During peak travel hours, any car with fewer than three people would be subject to the toll.

In return, drivers would have a guarantee that traffic in the toll lanes will not drop below 45 mph, Margaronis said.

Tolls would vary depending on the time of day and traffic. For instance, it would be more expensive to use a toll lane during rush hour than at a non-peak time.

Santa Clarita City Councilwoman Marsha McLean, who represents the city on a number of transportation boards, said she needs more information on the proposal before she decides whether to support it.

“Obviously there is a need to upgrade the I-5 sooner rather than later,” McLean said. “But there are still an awful lot of questions to be answered.”

Metro will hold two public meeting in Santa Clarita next week to collect public comment on the proposal. The first meeting is 6 p.m. Tuesday at the Santa Clarita Sports Complex, 20880 Centre Pointe Parkway, and the second is 6 p.m. on Thursday at Rancho Pico Junior High School, 26520 Valencia Blvd.

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Comments

Vtown123: Posted: February 22, 2013 6:15 a.m.

Absolutely not. These toll roads need to be a thing of the past. We pay for these roads in our taxes/dmv fees - stop double dipping. Maybe if the designers could ever plan for future traffic and make wider freeways than currently needed, we wouldn't have these problems.


DMeyer: Posted: February 22, 2013 9:19 a.m.

Again more taxes, when will it be enough?


tekmomllg: Posted: February 22, 2013 9:37 a.m.

"In return, drivers would have a guarantee that traffic in the toll lanes will not drop below 45 mph, Margaronis said."

How can they guarantee this? I've seen traffic in the 91 fwy toll lanes & the new 110 fwy toll lanes less than 45 mph often... leave the carpool lanes as is, or (like the 14 fwy) only for carpool during peak hours.

The main beneficiary of this deal is the "private entity".


castaicjack: Posted: February 22, 2013 10:15 a.m.

There's no justification for adding toll lanes here and it shouldn't be done at all. The project was approved and implemented with public monies with funding already in place and if they can't build it within those means then it ought not to be built in the first place. In addition, it doesn't appear justified to have those carpool lanes extend all the way to Parker Road because traffic is light in that area anyway. If you look at the traffic using the new carpool lane from the south I-5 to the south 14 in the Newhall pass, you'll immediately wonder why they wasted millions constructing it because it's hardly used at all. More wasted millions for another un-needed project. Why don't they build another library while they're at it...


ricketzz: Posted: February 22, 2013 10:24 a.m.

If you don't want to pay taxes how else do we get roads built? Any big construction job provides benefits for local merchants (and workers).


chico: Posted: February 22, 2013 10:34 a.m.

They should only charge the rich.

Like make Mercedes and Range Rovers pay, Pintos and mini vans are free.


chico: Posted: February 22, 2013 10:40 a.m.

Rickettz - you speak as if roads and bridges are a new thing for taxpayers. You mean existing taxes dont cover it? Finally someone should pay for the roads and bridges?

A new fee or tax is becoming a 'Soup du Jour' - bridges, health care, clean beaches, clean air, clean water, clean underwear - you name it....

Doesnt matter - they want money - and dad gummit they will find a way to get it.

Isn't this getting old?

Who's tired of this?


Mropinion: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:12 a.m.

With State gas taxes being around $0.38/gal(I don't know the exact amount} and the millions of gallons pumped every day in LA one would think we could have great roads if the revenues were not stolen for other reasons.


ohhyaa: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:18 a.m.

I like paying more taxes just like I enjoy holding my breath until I pass out. Oh well, looks like I'm having another slice of toast this morning instead of the real breakfast I really want.


Bdeezine: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:22 a.m.

What a shock. Another way to squeeze more money out of people. Pure nonsense. And how can they guarantee you'll always travel at least 45 mph? THEY CAN'T!!! What happens is the feds do an audit and if the traffic is not going at the minimum speed, they smack penalty fees on the state.... another money grab!! This is absolutely insane. If this happens, I hope people have the insight to boycott the plan and not spend a dime on this garbage.


sreilly11: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:23 a.m.

Funding gaps my A**......more like another mismanaged issue brought to you by the same old, same old peeps that have mismanaged everything else. Figure it out peeps when you going to stop voting for people that can't think out of the box?!?!?


Sam2222: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:30 a.m.

One wonders when the state will move from a defined benefit pension plan to a defined contribution pension plan for all new state employees. This would save a few dollars.


ohhyaa: Posted: February 22, 2013 11:32 a.m.

Maybe the State could construct a bridge that we can all jump off of. Gasoline is up 60 cents per gallon in the last month. I agree with Mropinion with the state taxes already collected. Where is that money? I always enjoy looking at the sticker on the side of the gas pump that breaks down the Federal and State taxes, per gallon. There should be an excess of money, instead a shortfall. Surprise, surprise, surprise.


lovelife: Posted: February 22, 2013 12:28 p.m.

Unbelievable! Talk about asinine!

Refresh my memory please... Isn't there a major proposed site to build 20,000 homes near 126 that will connect to I-5 ??? If I'm thinking clearly, it is going to be a mess along that stretch where Parker Road is... So now, put toll lanes to move traffic along ??? Forget about it! We shouldn't have to pick up the tab for this and I-5 needs to be widened for future developments at the expense of gasoline taxes that EVERYONE pays for.


andytheslash: Posted: February 22, 2013 12:50 p.m.

This should be done on the 405 from the NB start, all the way to the 10, IF it should be done at all! The 5 isn't very wide in the junction-to-Castaic stretch, so taking away an extra lane or two is going to make it worse for everyone else who don't want to pay, or perhaps, cannot afford it.


sreilly11: Posted: February 22, 2013 12:55 p.m.

Boycott the freeways - jam up the Old Road!!!!


Nitesho: Posted: February 22, 2013 1:10 p.m.

How many "Roads and Bridges taxes" have we been charged with over the years. I can recall at least 4 propositions and taxes that voters passed that promised to fix roads and bridges and ease congestion. Remember how voting for the lottery would fix school funding? how did that work out?

They will do it regardless as, well...suprise, they just happen to be building the extra lanes now. Funny how that just happen to work out for them.

But as always, the uneducated voter will get in line like the sheep they are and vote for this just like banning guns because how they look.


Vtown123: Posted: February 22, 2013 1:14 p.m.

Contact Marsha McLean at mmclean@santa-clarita.com


Nitesho: Posted: February 22, 2013 1:15 p.m.

ricketzz: Posted: February 22, 2013 10:24 a.m.

If you don't want to pay taxes how else do we get roads built? Any big construction job provides benefits for local merchants (and workers).


Maybe with the 4 other state and local propositions that were suppose to go to this and had the funds "reallocated"?


src: Posted: February 22, 2013 1:54 p.m.

The highest vehicle registration costs in the nation, swindled from us on a yearly basis, are supposed to cover this stuff. I thought CA was "back in the black"?


philellis: Posted: February 22, 2013 2:13 p.m.

We already have taxes that have been designated for roads whihc have been stolen for other uses. How long before the state would begin (mis)appropriating toll fees for purposes other than roads? I guess I am going to have to start referring to the Golden State Freeway as the I-5.


src: Posted: February 22, 2013 2:21 p.m.

philellis - or maybe we should just start referring to the "golden state" as the "lead state", unless there's something less valuable than lead...


lovelife: Posted: February 22, 2013 2:23 p.m.

Here's an excerpt concerning tolls...

Gas tax falling short in paying for transportation needs

The federal gas tax — 18.4 cents a gallon for gasoline, 24.4 cents for diesel — is growing anemic because of more fuel-efficient vehicles, Americans driving fewer miles and the growth of electric and alternative-fuel vehicles. The tax rate on gasohol and most other special fuels is much less.

"It no longer works as our primary source," says Jim Burnley, a Washington, D.C., transportation attorney who was Transportation secretary for President Reagan. "We're going to have to figure out, as a country, other mechanisms."

•More tolls. While it's often controversial, more communities are turning to tolling. Few experts expect tolling to become the sole method to finance roads and transit, but many see it playing a larger role.

"I can see tolls supplementing the gas tax," Finn says.

Expanded tolling has many detractors.

"I think tolling is a cop-out," says Greg Cohen, who heads the Highway Users Alliance, a non-profit coalition of highway supporters, AAA auto clubs, bus companies, farm bureaus and shopping centers. "Part of what makes America work is we have an interstate system and it's a toll-free system that really brings our country together."

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-02-07/gas-tax-not-enough-to-fund-roads/53228510/1


Rocketeer: Posted: February 22, 2013 2:41 p.m.

Last year alone the state of CA collected $16.64 BILLION in motor vehicle fuel taxes. Where the heck is that money going? Perhaps the same place as the $6.5 Billion they collect every year in DMV fees.

We've already paid for any and all freeway improvements. But the money was stolen by our elected officials, so now they need more money to pay for the work.

People have alluded to this, but I'm going to come right out and say it: This is just another unfortunate result of a state that's run by Democrats. They are the ones that have controlled the Legislature for over forty years and currently enjoy a Supermajority. Stuff like this is all part of the Democrat's "new normal."


tekmomllg: Posted: February 22, 2013 2:57 p.m.

To Castaic Jack: If you want to see the new carpool lanes on the south 14 to south 5 junction, hang out between 5:30 am - 8 am. The 14 is marked correctly with the usage (5am - 9am M-F) southbound. I think all the carpool lanes should be marked according to their usage. As a taxpayer and a commuter (vanpool & carpool) I think the carpool lanes should be 1)Free and 2) Marked according to when the main 'rush hour is'. In my opinion, they should be for carpools only, not for single riders with hybrid or electric vehicles, and not for people who want to pay to use them.

I also agree with others that there is no need for carpool lanes north of the 126. That is really a waste of money.


Bdeezine: Posted: February 22, 2013 3:25 p.m.

First they bellyache about how people should conserve and use less gas. Now they are crying because we are consuming less gas and they are not making enough revenue. What a crock. No matter what we do, we lose. We really need an accurate audit of where this money is all going and I think jailtime is in order for some of our beloved elected officials.


ohhyaa: Posted: February 22, 2013 3:29 p.m.

Legalize pot to pay for this. We already a bunch of "dope" heads running the State. lol


hopeful: Posted: February 22, 2013 3:34 p.m.

We have already paid for a portion of the carpool extension (from the 14-5 freeway interchange to Pico Canyon)by voting for Measure R in 2008, which raised the L.A. County sales taxes by $.50 temporarily. So now, they want to charge tolls, AND raise the carpool occupancy to 3 people instead of 2, so we can get the carpool lanes extended to Parker Lane faster than it otherwise would be completed?

To see more about Measure R go to: http://www.metro.net/projects/measurerhighwayprojects/

We have one of the highest gas taxes, registration taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, income taxes, etc...

At what point will our legislatures think we pay enough?


cms96: Posted: February 22, 2013 3:50 p.m.

They should make the rich pay for these roads. Make it like a country club membership where the only people who can use it are the ones who paid for it.
That way I dont get stuck paying for something I rarely use.


lovelife: Posted: February 22, 2013 4:22 p.m.

Where's useless "Buck" McKeon ???

@Rocketeer - "They (Democrats) are the ones that have controlled the Legislature for over forty years"

California's Democrats do not care whether one broke the law to arrive here or continues to break it by staying. It asks nothing of the illegal immigrant - no proficiency in English, no acquaintance with American history and values, no proof of income, no record of education or skills. It DOES provide all the public assistance that it can afford (and more that it borrows for), and apparently waives enforcement of most of California's burdensome regulations and civic statutes that increasingly have plagued productive citizens to the point of driving them out. How odd that we over-regulate those who are citizens and have capital to the point of banishing them from the state, but do not regulate those who are aliens and without capital to the point of encouraging millions more to follow in their footsteps.

That's part of the problem CA has with inadequate funding. The state legislature steals from this till and places it over in this till - while picking up the tab for free-loaders. We have more people and cars in this state than anywhere else in the US and we don't have sufficient DMV/fuel taxes to fund roads ??? I don't believe a word of it!
=======
California's budget deficit is gone after years of financial troubles, Governor Jerry Brown said on Thursday, proposing a plan that raises spending on education and healthcare, boosting total expenditures by 5 percent.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/10/california-budget-surplus-2013_n_2450349.html

Surplus ??? With letting the jailbirds out early because there aren't enough funds, and roads/bridges/traffic congestion, etc..., and there's a surplus ??? I think that Brown is smoking crack, not pot...

@Bdeezine - "We really need an accurate audit of where this money is all going"

Can you say that a little bit louder please ???


ohhyaa: Posted: February 22, 2013 4:35 p.m.

Does anyone think that this might really be to generate money for the Jerry Brown High Speed Train to nowhere?


hen5193: Posted: February 22, 2013 5:12 p.m.

Whats so bad about this. This should help improve traffic. The project will be mostly funded by private funds and its not going to take away any lanes from the freeway. Interstate 5 right now only has 4 lanes each way. With trucks using up the two right lanes. And cars the two left. With this and the truck lane the 5 will go from 4 to 6 lanes over the pass. Carpools will still be free and if you do pay a toll it will probably be pretty low. This adds capacity to a freeway and not take it away. Toll lanes are very high tech and are continuously monitored so they can be free flowing. Another great thing about this project is that it will repave all of the 5 from the 14 to Castaic and we all know that the 5 is sorely in need of repaving. Go on metro's website (i put the link at the end) and inform yourself like i did after reading this because like always the signal came a liitle short here with proparly reporting it. http://www.metro.net/projects/i-5-n-capacity-enhancements/


lovelife: Posted: February 22, 2013 5:57 p.m.

@hen - "Whats so bad about this"

Well, it does appear that 99% of the Signal posters here are against it. I would love to see the city post a ballot on their website to see the communities reaction. After all, it is OUR town and 1-5 is way too congested for SCV residents who live on that side of town.

You are right, the roads heading to Castaic are a disaster and are in desperate need of repair. So, it appears there are not ample funds to fix that area of one of the most heavily trafficked main thoroughfare up and down CA...

BHOs campaign promises to America was to fix the bridges/roads... What happened after the election that changed that ??? Oh I guess the Democrats are busy pushing gun control instead of fixing bridges/roads and improving highways...

Legislatures = Bunch of hypocrites... (BHO - Pelosi - Reid - Jerry Brown - Buck McKeon) etc...



Frustrated: Posted: February 22, 2013 6:41 p.m.

Seriously???? This is a joke. The morons up in Sacramento should all be FIRED! And the people of California just keep voting them back in. What the heck? If a private company had been hired for this project to begin with it would have been done on a budget and on time. I am so tired of L.A. County footing the bill for everything. Like a STUPID high speed rail system that every other county is going to use. I could not believe my eyes when I saw that one passed. So this does not surprise me. They are going to keep squeezing unless we the people make some big changes and soon. Wake up people and spread the word. PLEASE.


DMeyer: Posted: February 22, 2013 7:45 p.m.

@Frustrated

You are so right. More tax and spend, it just goes on and on.


lars: Posted: February 22, 2013 8:57 p.m.

"Santa Clarita City Councilwoman Marsha McLean, who represents the city on a number of transportation boards, said she needs more information on the proposal before she decides whether to support it."

Marsha, please do not run for re-election, otherwise you will be embarassed. You mentality is stick it to the taxpayer. What a piece of work you are!
Your incompetence as a member of the sanitation board resulted in fines, that I guess in your opinion, should be paid by the taxpayers.

Marsha, are you looking for campaign contributions before you decide to support the private company stealing our tax money?

You were nowhere to be found when the sneaky flood control fee mailer was sent at christmas time. Only Tim and Bob represented the citizens. I appreciate their efforts as councilmembers representing the taxpayers. They will have my vote.

I dont know what is worse in this article, the underhanded methods that these people think that they can steal money from a wealthy community, or your lack of interests in supporting the taxpayers/voters.
Remember that when you do not get re-elected.


Bdeezine: Posted: February 22, 2013 9:15 p.m.

@Lars: Bravo.


hen5193: Posted: February 22, 2013 9:38 p.m.

I would prefer that these were regular carpool lanes. But if building them this way makes them be built faster than so be it. I would blame Sacramento. County Agency's like metro have to do this to make up for the shortfalls when it comes to our freeways. But hey what can you do. People should go the meetings and inform themselves. I know i plan to go.


emheilbrun: Posted: February 23, 2013 12:46 a.m.

The answer to our transportation problems is not one more lane. It's a comprehensive approach to getting people out of their cars and into public transportation. Dedicated bus lanes instead of HOV lanes, park & rides, car sharing services like ZIP Car, light rail like the Metro Gold line along the 210 fwy. Tax incentives for using public transportation. The answer is NOT high speed rail trains to nowhere, but alternatives for the daily commute WITHIN our metropolitan areas. The guarantee that speeds won't drop below 45 mph in the toll lanes means that usage of the toll lanes is sparse compared to the other lanes that will inevitably become MORE congested with drivers unwilling to pay the tolls.


lovelife: Posted: February 23, 2013 2:26 a.m.

Can most commuters afford this ???

New Toll Lanes Set to Open Along 10 Freeway

Read more: http://ktla.com/2013/02/22/new-toll-lanes-set-to-open-along-10-freeway/#ixzz2Lhjbo8Tl


hen5193: Posted: February 23, 2013 3:46 a.m.

Yea they can. Fastraks cost only $15 plus $25 of free tolls to familys makeing less than 30,000 a year.


Bdeezine: Posted: February 23, 2013 9:38 a.m.

Yeah, go ahead and suck us dry. Get it over with already.


chefgirl358: Posted: February 23, 2013 10:39 a.m.

This is the dumbest idea ever! Carpool lanes should be extinct, let alone toll lanes. They'll never recoup the cost, it's proven at all the other toll lanes, that they aren't used enough to repay the cost. Besides, we already pay for road maintenance, etc. stupid jerks keep trying to tax us MORE, double dip, etc.


CastaicClay: Posted: February 23, 2013 11:12 a.m.

I do not like the idea of a private company making money on public property.


lovelife: Posted: February 23, 2013 1:16 p.m.

Seriously, there is no doubt that there are plenty of families here in CA that make a decent income. True, many of them live right here in SCV. But, this is not Beverly Hills, Bel-Air, Malibu, etc... where household incomes are in the millions. The average person making a comfortable salary is burdened with major expenses raising children, then college tuition and so on. Everone of us have been smacked with getting less for our money while trying to keep ourselves out of quicksand.

To fast track to the current proposals of toll lanes throughout SoCal, is a serious burden on families. I do agree that the public should take advantage of public transportation more than they do, but; be realistic about this... First, LA isn't designed with transportation like the east coast is. There you can jump on subways, metros, trains, etc., and go anywhere you need to. SoCal will NEVER be like the east coast, so we have to "make do" with what has already been put into place. True, build better highways, freeways, a metro here and there, but the majority of people out here cannot depend on our public transportation like others in the east can. So, therefore, we have no choice but to sit on jammed freeways, and we're lucky to be able to ride in a car pool lane. How many people here will admit to car pooling? I would bet hardly three or four people max!

This toll road idea has great intentions with many negatives. Like others have mentioned, they hardly pay for themselves, and it limits the opportunity to use toll roads for only the people who can afford it. That's certainly not fair to the less privledged, lower income individuals who are trying to make ends meet with what they have... Our fuel taxes/DMV renewals are in the billions - so let that revenue pay for ALL the roads...


lars: Posted: February 23, 2013 8:06 p.m.

To marsha and all the city trolls who support this idea.

The rate today is $1.40 per mile. That will go up in the future,
as cost of living and public worker salaries go up by the union contracted 15 percent per year.

To drive the 20 mles from Lake Hughes Road in Castaic to the San Fernando Valley would be
$28 one way
$56 round trip per day
$280 per week
$14,560 per year

marsha and troll city workers please identify yourselves with your support of this program raping the taxpayers.
The private company is just the right fit for the swindler city council members. Just as they took the "PUBLIC" library away from the public to a private company, they will take the "PUBLIC" roads away from the public and give them to a private company.

After all, they advertise Santa Clarita as a BUSINESS FRIENDLY CITY.
The city council members will use public funds fro private companies.


lovelife: Posted: February 23, 2013 8:54 p.m.

@lars: Thanks for spelling it out for our city officials to see right before their eyes. However, what you forgot to include is the tank of gas every week to commute round trip. That's close to another $60 a week right there in addition to what you just displayed!


hen5193: Posted: February 23, 2013 9:51 p.m.

@lars tolls range from 0.25 to 1.40 a mile the lanes on the 10 and 110 have never hit the high mark. Plus its based on how far you go. So lets say you get on the express lane at Lyons thats 6 miles and the averge rate is about 60 to 70 cents a mile so it would be about a 4 bucks to the 14. The most of the toll paying traffic will use the lane between lyons and the 14. The toll rate is based on traffic the less less traffic the lower the toll the moree traffic the higher the toll. Plus carpools are free. I just dont get it. Who loses on this. The free will get more lanes. On top of the existing 4. The lanes in LA uses lanes that preexisted so traffic was going to change. Here its gaining so what is there too lose


ohhyaa: Posted: February 23, 2013 10:51 p.m.

hen5193. I have been following the posts on this thread, in an effort to better understand the various viewpoints, but am not sure what your last post is really saying. From my point of view the addition of another lane is part of regular highway improvements that are a part of the revenue already collected. I would be okay if the additional lane was designated as HOV since there seems to be a bottleneck where the carpool lane ends just north of the 14. The current construction on the north 5 at the 14 interchange is dangerous and has been going on for a ridiculously long time. Now they want to make that a toll road?? No way. That lane belongs to the people, period the end.


lars: Posted: February 24, 2013 12:54 a.m.

hen, as a member of city government(only government workers would support more taxes), you do know about the tens of thousands of new homes going in off the 126.

Where do you think these people will work? Where will they have to commute? To put it in simple terms, they will have to use the 5 freeway to commute to their jobs in the valley, or other parts of LA.
This will add thousands of commuter cars to the 5 freeway.

Your opinions suggests that its only $4 for someone from lyons, how about these new people from the 126, only $10 each way, possibly a little more?

Your missing the point. We pay taxes for road improvements. We dont pay taxes for your salary or government pensions.
Your city workers have decided to spend our tax money on an expensive library. It sticks out like a sore thumb. Not appropriate for the area. Now your city workers want a roundabound so people can see your taj mahal.
The city workers have spent millions on stupid art projects, signs for the auto dealers, putting benches and brickes on creekside, etc.
The city workers are not that responsible when they are spending taxpayer money, but your attitude is lets stick it to the taxpayer and get more money so we can send it on stupid wastful projects.


hen5193: Posted: February 24, 2013 2:22 a.m.

Lars. Im actually not a city worker. LOL i hope they don't build all those houses along the 126. Its a great drive that would be ruined. The construction along the pass right now is only too add a truck lane so that cars have the 3 left lanes and trucks have the right two instead of the current left 2 lanes for cars and right 2 lanes for trucks. The toll lanes in my opinion would add capacity to the existing 4 lanes. Carpoolers are free and solo driver can chose to pay a toll or drive the general lanes. And to clarify on who i am. I am a political science major student at COC. I inform my self on things before i say my opinion. And yes Santa Clarita does have a stupid habit of wasting money like signs and decorating but this project would only be by metro since Interstate 5 is not at all in Santa Clarita' s jurisdiction. One thing that causes traffic on the 5 is the fact that its faster to get from the the area's on the west side of the 5 to the areas along the 14 by using the freeways to hook around city than to drive through it. If i could i would raise the speed limits along newhall ranch and golden valley to 60 since its such a wide road and to 55 along soledad to get across town faster but hey what can you do.


lars: Posted: February 24, 2013 11:53 a.m.

hen, since you are a student, and study issues, please investigate your opinions.
You say some traffic on the 5 is from the fact that its faster to get from the areas on the west side of the 5 to the areas along the 14 by using the freeways to hook around city than to drive through it..

I agree with you.

But your opinion says its due to a lower speed limit 50-55 mph instead of the 65mph freeway speed.

This is wrong. The reason why it takes longer is the city's traffic lights and lack of synchronization.
The 3 cross-valley roads

1(Valencia Blvd-Soledad Cyn)
2(Newhall Ranch Road-Golden Valley Road)
3.Rye Canyon-Copper Hill-Boquet Cyn-Plum Canyon-Whites Canyon)

One reason are detours, Copperhill road was never finished (stupid city sign that the road will be extended in the future. A sign that has been there for over 10 years). Why?

The major reason is unsynchronized traffic lights. I assume you have a car.
Drive on these roads, and count the number of lights and red lights that you hit. Your average speed will be around 25mph even though the speed limit is 50 mph. There is a stupid light on newhall ranch road near the bridge over the river by soledad cyn road. There is nothing there, but the light turns red? Why?

As a political science major, someone should indoctrinate you on the underhanded methods goverment uses to deceive taxpayer voters.
The elected officals get campaign contributions so they can get re-elected.
They support those who give them campaign contributions, private companies or unions, and devise methods to stick it to the taxpayer voters.

This has spread to the surface in Santa Clarita. Some at the city feel they can take taxpayer funded public facilities, and give them to their campaign contributor private companies. They feel they can spen Millions on their whims, disregarding ublic opinion.

The "NEW" public hearings are a JOKE.
People raise their voices, but the city does'nt listen. Another Walmart at the mall and a roundabout in newhall will be built irregardless of what the public wants.

Those who do not listen are no longer "public" officials.

The ex-mayor ender, the ex-city manager ken, and the soon to be ex-city council member ferry are gone.

With 99% of the comments against this stupid idea, you have a stick it to the taxpayer city council member marsha feeling she has to think about it.

The next election will see the end of the last two holdouts of the stick it to the taxpayer attitude. marsha and laurene will not be reelected


lovelife: Posted: February 24, 2013 1:31 p.m.

@hen - "I am a political science major student at COC"

Thank you for your interest in political science as a student. You will find that political science intersects with other fields - including economics. I will assume you are at a very young 18-23 year old bracket. If so, I too was young (17) when I started CoC while obtaining pre-requisites for university afterwards. Kudos for being so ambitious to learn political science - there is a LOT to learn there!

However, while I assume you are very young, I have to assume you haven't had to experience the costs of everyday living - especially raising toddlers and all the expenses that go with raising a family later on. But, many of us have, and it's extremely tough to have additional costs of living added to your family budget. In addition to rent, car payments, automobile insurance, vehicle maintenance, food, gasoline, medical insurance premiums, student loans, etc..., average people don't have much left over. That includes SAVINGS for that rainy day - and to put something aside towards 401k when we retire hopefully at 67 or later. There's a long stretch between Jr.College years and the end of our lives; that is, God willing... There are many bumpy roads that each and every one of us will encounter. Those obstacles cost plenty of money - especially when a family is burdened with the loss of the bread winner's salary and then goes onto a lower paying job just to make ends meet.

Most people cannot afford toll lanes in addition to their everyday expenses. The ideas of moving traffic along quickly are all great ideas, but they are VERY costly. Again, we're not extremely wealthy, and don't have Hollywood names and incomes, so the average person driving from SCV 1-5 to SF valley or LA, isn't going to favor such an added cost to commute. While a young college student that is living at home under mommy and daddy's roof, with gas and insurance paid for by them, isn't living in the real world until you move out and are COMPLETELY on your own...

I am, in NO way, bashing you for your opinions, but MOST of us cannot afford added costs to an already huge cost of living...


TalkToMissV: Posted: February 24, 2013 2:34 p.m.

I have already spoken out against this toll lane at meetings twice this week. And NO ONE was there standing with me... to have a hope in succeeding to have your voices heard please come make yourself heard! There are two opportunities this week!!
♦♦♦ Public meetings will be held this week ♦♦♦
Tues the 26th @ Santa Clarita Sports Complex
20880 Centre Point Pkwy @ 6 p.m
••••••
Thurs the 28th @ Rancho Pico Junior High School
26250 Valencia Blvd Stevenson Ranch @ 6 p.m.


TalkToMissV: Posted: February 24, 2013 2:44 p.m.

not only are Tolls a dumb idea... so are HOV lanes! all they do is CREATE traffic! and up here, north of Lyons Ave we only have traffic in two scenarios... 1) there is an accident, no HOV or Toll lane will help you there & 2) the freeway is closed do to snow!, again... no HOV or Toll lane will help you


lovelife: Posted: February 24, 2013 2:55 p.m.

@MissV "NO ONE was there standing with me"

Thank you for taking time to show up and address this. You'll find that many people are concerned, but don't have the time to show up and speak their peace. However, many of us, including myself, have spoken in front of the city on other matters concerning the well-being of SCV residents. As you know, you are allowed 3 minutes to speak and the cameras are rolling every second you are speaking.

We have found that attendance at meetings during HOA matters, usually doesn't bring an audience of many. In fact, usually zilch! I believe that shipping an email to Marsha, furnished by another poster here, will certainly help. It's a great paper trail, and it's in WRITING which bears a lot of weight like speaking in front of the cameras. In fact, the email can be lengthy, more informative, and speaks volumes - even more than a 3 minute "rushed" statement in person can...

Thanks for your involvement!


TalkToMissV: Posted: February 24, 2013 2:56 p.m.

and just to clear up something hen5193 said... "car-poolers are free" in fact, not as we think off it - 3 or MORE people in a car are free (as are buses and motorcycles) but 2 people in a car, is NOT FREE on these HOV/Toll lanes. They dont need to pay as much as a single driver, but they still pay. Even people I know in the CHP say this is hardly enforceable, people learn where the transponder signals are and bounce in and out of the lanes - it's just a waste - do the construction over 30 years (AS WAS PLANNED)... I dont care, I dont want it up here anyway - these lane additions are going to end at the WORST possible spot up here in Castaic (Just shy of Parker Road) because they dont want to tackle the expense of redoing the bridge to accommodate the additional lanes - it's going to be UGLY! and I dont mean atheistically.


chadman: Posted: February 25, 2013 12:59 a.m.

Wouldn't it be nice is all the drivers were polite and attentive so that some of us could just commute on motorcycles? What traffic problem?


hen5193: Posted: February 25, 2013 3:28 a.m.

@lars yes its true the traffic lights in Santa Clarita are one huge issue such as Sierra/Golden Valley but all im saying is the lanes wont cause traffic since they will add capacity, not take anything away. If we leave the freeway like this then nothing will change and capacity wont change. Also Santa Clarita city government has no control over this since the city limts never cross the 5. The freeway is under caltrans and LA Metro's control


TalkToMissV: Posted: February 25, 2013 11:53 a.m.

@ Lovelife - thank you for the support, HOWEVER, these are not City Council Meetings, trust me, there are more people to influence this than the SC City Council, I spoke at the Castaic Town Council Meeting and the Val Verde Civic Association meetings so far, and the two meetings I listed above for this week, they are Metro/County meetings, the Council has no control over them at all - so please, to anyone and everyone who CAN MAKE IT.... come on out


ElizaS: Posted: February 25, 2013 1:19 p.m.

@lars- The proposed Toll lanes is a project by Metro. The City of Santa Clarita has no control over the issue. The City can either take a position to support or not support the project but ultimately they have no say.

Personally, I am not in support of the project because I do not think the tolls will cover the cost but there is a lot of misinformation that has been said about the project. Taxpayers have not paid for this project already. Measure R that was passed provided a portion of the funding for this project but is not available until closer 2040. Without the private company stepping in, the project would not be completed until then. Adding the private company with the tolls, allows it to be completed faster in the next 6 years. The taxes that everyone pays does not cover the cost of both maintenance and new construction costs. It hasn't now for decades.

Again, I am not for the project because I do not think the congestion is bad enough that they are going to recoup the cost of construction/maintenance through tolls.


lovelife: Posted: February 25, 2013 5:21 p.m.

@MissV - "these are not City Council Meetings"

You made yourself clear and you mentioned that you spoke at the two different meetings at two different locations. But, I will admit to NOT expressing my statement more clearly while confusing people. I just wanted people to know that speaking at the city meeting was directed at talking to the council members, and ALSO to the public in attendance there.

Simply stated, I agree with you, MissV, and recommend that folks show up at ANY community meeting to voice their opposition. Clearly, the officials will get the message! Also, writing an email to Marsha McLean is a great method of communication for those who cannot show up at meetings to voice their opposition.

Being that this topic is all too new to me and I understand this is the Dept of Transportation's agenda, I'm not certain where the city council has any influence on this matter. I do understand that Marsha McLean represents the city on a number of transportation boards, but what is NOT clear to me is what impact will her decision have on this project ??? To me, if her decision was in opposition to this project, will that put the brakes on this project completely or will the Dept of Trans shove it down our throats anyway ???

I'm also not certain if this matter will ever be an item on the city agenda at a future meeting. I suggest that everyone go to the city website and sign up for emails though. The emails will inform us about agendas that will be discussed at the next scheduled meetings. As some people know, the city only has two meetings on the second and fourth Tuesday of EVERY month. Everyone should know that Time Warner customers can watch city meetings live on channel 20 and also on the City's Website @ http://apps.santa-clarita.com/video/

Also, in the past, I have personally had issues that were addressed directly to the CA Dept of Trans. I had great results with Kelly Markham and she resolved many issues. I know I will be contacting her in this matter!

Kelly Markham
Public Information Officer
California Department of Transportation
100 S. Main St.
Los Angeles, CA 90012
(213) 897-0303

www.dot.ca.gov/dist07
www.I-5info.com


Kelly Markham <kelly_markham@dot.ca.gov>


ElizaS: Posted: February 25, 2013 6:30 p.m.

@lovelife- This is a proposed project by the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Agency (MTA or Metro). The project page can be found here: http://www.metro.net/projects/i-5-n-capacity-enhancements/ The page lists several contact names. I suggest voicing your opinion to one of those contacts.

While Marsha McLean takes an interest in transportation issues, she sits on no formal body that can approve or disapprove this project. Since this is not a City project, it will not come to a vote to build or not to build before the Council. However, the Council might take a position to support or not support the project and therefore it could show up on the agenda.

I would suggest going to the meetings on Tuesday and Thursday since they are being held by Metro, the ones making the decision to either proceed with the project or not.


TalkToMissV: Posted: February 28, 2013 12:41 p.m.

As is common for The Signal, there is more than one Article/Column running concurrently... on the other one I FOUND BY ACCIDENT... I saw a very good point made by *Lars* it read;

"Car pool lanes were added on 20 miles of the 405 freeway in the San Fernando Valley without a "fee" burden. The residents there do not make alot of money.

Car pool lanes were added on over 20 miles of the 14 freeway from the 5 to Palmdale without any fee. The residents there do not make alot of money.

Now car pool lanes need to be added on 10 miles of freeway from castaic to the 14. The resident there do make alot of money. Lets charge them a fee to use something that they paid alot of taxes for. "


VanessaBrookman: Posted: March 1, 2013 2:09 a.m.

Tonights meeting was for WHAT??? no presentation to speak of, 10 minutes of over view and then everyone can go to the tables and ask questions. Without a proper presentation, people who havent heard about this in depth wouldn't even know WHAT questions to ask! stay tuned... I hear there will be more in March, we need to make them give honest answers!


savvydivanista: Posted: March 1, 2013 2:39 a.m.

feel the need to chime in on this,

first I along with 4 others in my family attended tonights meeting and there were maybe 25 people at this meeting (not including metro and caltrans reps). There was not one city council member or city official that I saw, who was there was Supervisor Antonivich's office and Assemblyman Wilks office.

One of the people in the audience was an off duty CHP officer who patrols the 110 freeway including the toll lane that has been in affect for what 3 months now, he gave valid information based on real facts of his job what he deals with during his shift, the metro people could not comment on what he was saying, except "our data doesnt suggest that", he continued by telling them "look on paper this sounds good, but I am telling you as an officer who patrols this it is an epic failure, traffic is worse in most cases and that is going to have an effect on response times when we are really needed" Their response "was well if everyone would purchase these transponders and use these lanes it would open up traffic"

oh and to whomever it was above who said high DMV fees ... your DMV fees pay for our California Highway Patrol officers, the tickets they write do not pay their salaries!

Here is some basic math on these lanes:

do the math, with more congestion on this 13.5 mile stretch you buy a transponder for $40 (dont forget there is a $3 monthly service charge not mentioned) so for the luxery of not sitting an extra 10-20 min on aveage it will cost you 38 and change (round up to $40 for maths sake cuz i suck at math)
17 minutes ago · Like
Bonnie Shierts thats $40 a day x 5 days = 200 a week to not sit in traffic X that by 4.1 (thats the average based on a 52 calendar week) that comes out to $820 a month to not sit in traffic

keep in mind this is based on 1.40 (peak traffic toll cost)

if you did it at .25 (low toll fee no peak) round trip 27.0 miles (thats 13.5 each direction) = 6.75 per day x 5 days =33.75 x 4.1 is still 138.75 per month to drive in a lane on a public highway when there is no major traffic


VanessaBrookman: Posted: March 10, 2013 2:39 p.m.

Hey everyone, we have created a FaceBook "Event" for the Next Meeting coming up on March 28th at SCV City Hall. Get LOTS of useful information and let your voice be heard. Together, we are BIG :) Use this link to join our Forum on Facebook - Hope to see you there

http://www.facebook.com/events/441493762598168/



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