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UPDATE: Saugus High senior killed by car

17-year-old swim team manager described as being ‘always about the team’

Posted: August 19, 2014 9:39 a.m.
Updated: August 19, 2014 5:03 p.m.

Jennifer Stift was a Saugus High School student and team manager for the Saugus High girls swim team.

 

A 17-year-old girl who became the heart and spirit of the Saugus girls swim team has died after she was hit by a car while jogging, law enforcement and school officials said Tuesday.

Jennifer Stift, a senior at Saugus High School, died as a result of injuries suffered in the collision around 8:30 p.m. Monday, said Officer John Lutz of the California Highway Patrol.

She was pronounced dead at Henry Mayo Newhall Hospital about 9 p.m. Monday, he said in a collision report issued Tuesday.

“We took her on as a team manager and she was at every swim meet, cheering everyone on because she was always about the team,” said Victoriana Donnelly, coach of the Saugus girls swim team.

“She was such an outgoing individual,” Donnelly said on the phone from Oregon, holding back tears.

“She was always smiling. She was the first person to arrive for practice and the first person to say ‘Hi’ to me,” she said. “If I was having a bad day she would make one of her weird faces and, immediately, lighten the mood.

“Her attitude was: ‘We’re here; let’s make the most of the day,’” Donnelly said.

Hit by car
Stift was apparently jogging across Golden Valley Road at Samantha Court in Saugus around 8:30 p.m. when she was hit by a car driven by a 17-year-old Santa Clarita resident. The minor’s name was not released.

He was driving a 1989 Toyota Celica, according to the CHP collision report.

Neither alcohol nor drugs was believed to be a factor in the collision, the report said.

Grief counselors were on hand at Saugus High School on Tuesday morning for students who needed to talk about Stift’s death, said Gail Pinsker, spokeswoman for the William S. Hart Union High School District.

“There is grief counseling under way since before school started today, and (it) will be available for as long as any students need,” she said Tuesday.

“The Saugus High School family, along with the entire Hart school district, is saddened by this news,” Pinsker said. “Our hearts and thoughts go out to Jennifer’s family and friends.”

Stift underwent hip surgery last year, said Donnelly, who added she received back-to-back phone calls from crying members of the 90-member swim team Tuesday morning.

“After her hip surgery she was a lot fitter,” the coach said, “and she was out there trying to maintain that healthy lifestyle.”

Condolences
Notes of condolence from scores of friends were posted on various Facebook pages and other social media.

One note, apparently from Stift’s fellow Saugus High Class of 2015 students, reads: “Our deepest condolences go out to the friends and family of the beautiful Jennifer Stift, the girl whose smile could light up a room.”

Saugus High Principal Bill Bolde sent a message of condolence to parents Tuesday morning.

“It hurts and there’s no easy way to deal with the pain,” he wrote. “If needed, students have been encouraged to meet in small groups or individually with counselors to process their emotions. ...We know that it may take time to heal this deep wound.

“We also call on all parents to engage in a conversation on the home front about today’s events. Talk to your kids about their thoughts and feelings. Allow them to release any emotions that may be harbored deep within,” Bolde wrote.

Stift was one of five daughters of Monica and Michael Stift of Saugus. Her sisters include Samantha, Katie, Becky and Michelle, who was on the Saugus girls swim team.

jholt@signalscv.com
661-287-5527
on Twitter @jamesarthurholt

 

 

 

Comments

EgbertSouse4U: Posted: August 19, 2014 1:03 p.m.

Poor thing. How sad. Prayers to her family, that's devastating. Awful.


NotSoAwesomeTown: Posted: August 19, 2014 1:54 p.m.

Oh this is bad. That poor family.

Neither alcohol nor drugs was believed to be a factor, but it will be interesting to see if speed was.


missyJk: Posted: August 19, 2014 2:16 p.m.

condolences to the families..what a tragic accident


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 19, 2014 2:33 p.m.

Golden Valley Rd. at Plum Canyon is no stranger to these types of serious traffic accidents.

Residents have been complaining for years of drivers driving really fast, especially at night to the hours before dawn.

Santa Clarita Sheriff's has been notified in the past of speeding, racing, and other questionable activities, like fights, vandalism, etc.

But since this area is not technically part of Santa Clarita, and is un-incorporated, there seems to be a lack of follow up or serious presence to curb all the unwanted activities on this small strip of road.

The CHP, also shies away from this road, knowing all the multiple times serious accidents have occurred, having done the reports for each.

I hope the Signal will look into this particular strip of road and do an expose on all the accidents that have taken place, there is a pattern.

It's too late for the HS student, but maybe our city, county and LE agencies can prevent more deaths.

R.I.P. Jennifer Stift and condolences to the friends and family and to her High School.


chefgirl358: Posted: August 19, 2014 3:02 p.m.

I am so terribly sorry for everyone's loss of this beautiful young lady. What a truly horrible tragedy, for everyone involved.


Unreal: Posted: August 19, 2014 3:22 p.m.

The 17 year old will have to remember this his whole life. How awful. He did stop and call for help which was the right thing to do. We have too many examples of others (adults too) who just take off. I will pray for all involved in this tragedy.


NotSoAwesomeTown: Posted: August 19, 2014 3:43 p.m.

As I've stated on numerous occasions, I live at the intersection of Plum & Golden Valley. The speeds are INSANE. So much so, that my adult son doesn't want to drive - and who can blame him? Cars blow through the light regularly, paying no heed to whether or not it's red. It's a free for all. I've typed this before. It's still just as bad as it ever was, and is getting worse. I invite ANY Deputy to just sit in my living room and watch for a couple of hours. It's just incredible.

Golden Valley road is a drag strip. It's as bad as many of the watched trouble spots in town - Bouquet Canyon road from Centurion to beyond Plum, Alta Vista/Kelly Johnson/Constellation, Haskell Canyon Road, Copper Hill b/t Haskell & Benz....the list goes on and on. They HAD TO HAVE KNOWN that Golden Valley was going to be like this. Just LOOK at the road. There's nothing to keep people from flooring it around the curve, and that's exactly what they do.

I think there should be a Commission of residents, Planners from City Hall, and Deputies to meet regularly and discuss options for these hotspots. There are not enough Deputies to go around in this city, so doing traffic isn't as far up on the list as is responding to calls. They're now "putting out fires" instead of preventing them in the first place. The City has grown too large.

It's disgusting that such a promising young girl has had to die because of this. It's out of control and it's time someone listens.


cbs617: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:20 p.m.

Praying for both families. Very tragic and sad.


Sprit2: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:23 p.m.

User Removed Comment.


chefgirl358: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:27 p.m.

Notsoawesometown,

I'm sure that you are right about it being a speedway, but NOTHING has stated that speed was a factor in this particular accident.


Unreal: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:31 p.m.

There is no reason to blame speed when there have been no charges or accusations of this. For now it is just a terrible accident. Two 17 year olds, one who had her life ended and the other who has had his life changed forever.

I see people out jogging all the time in the dark and they are very hard to see. People, please when biking or jogging in the dark or early in the morning, stay out of the street and don't rely on a small light that does not even cut the dark. WE CAN'T SEE YOU BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!!

Do we really want to be like other towns in the news these days who jump up and down before ALL the facts are in?


frankjustice: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:34 p.m.

Just want to send my heartfelt condolences to the family of this young lady.


NotSoAwesomeTown: Posted: August 19, 2014 4:43 p.m.

I was responding to AdamTwelve's comment.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 19, 2014 5:09 p.m.

That's not jumping to conclusion.

It's an informed opinion and a bit of relevant background shedding light on the street in question.

Golden Valley Rd. curves approaching Samantha St. and with excessive speed making it a blind curve.

It's 55 mph limit, residents have also requested it lowered for better traffic enforcement, but since it's an
un-incorporated area and considered a non-residential portion, because technically it's the backyards that touch the road, it's been left 55 mph.

Could the driver have been texting? distracted? mechanical malfunction? just not have seen? YES, but based on residents experience of said street, 99.9% tell us it was speed.

But the point is that something has to be done about it.


timothymyers02: Posted: August 19, 2014 5:12 p.m.

Runners and walkers PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE when there is no sidewalk run AGAINST traffic so that you can quickly react if you are unseen by the vehicle driver or if they accidentally drift.


bobforte: Posted: August 19, 2014 5:53 p.m.

Drivers PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE pay attention to the road when you are driving.


courtneybenno: Posted: August 19, 2014 6:28 p.m.

We are all going to miss you Jennifer! Saugus High and Saugus Swim will never be the same without you there! You were our little ray of sunshine on a hard day! This is so shocking, I still see her everywhere I look. I miss you! Rest In Peace Jennifer Stift.


BoxerMom: Posted: August 19, 2014 8:56 p.m.

My heart is broken for all involved. This is devastating. Rest peacefully, pretty girl.


ohhyaa: Posted: August 19, 2014 9:58 p.m.

As a Mother I cannot imaging how difficult losing a child could be. My prayers are for both families.


Nitsho: Posted: August 19, 2014 10:16 p.m.

Adam12. Let LE come up with the facts. Speculation adds nothing, regardless of opinion.


Denn99: Posted: August 19, 2014 11:13 p.m.

Notsoawsome, thanks for pointing out Haskell Canyon Road. North of Copperhill, just about every car speeds through this residential area. It is not unusual to see cars whip by at 50 and at times 60 mph, and that is no exageration. We are all terrified to back out of our driveways,and the belligerant drivers act like we have a problem, honking, tailgating and road raging us down our street. I can't believe the County actually approved a neighborhood to be constructed in such a manner. Luckily, and it is luck, that no one has been killed. How the city allows this to go on is beyond me. Someday something will happen and the city is probably going to be sued for letting this dragstrip go on in a neighborhood.


missyJk: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:13 a.m.

when a speed limit is 50-55 please please remember a car a mile away will be on you in a minute


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 20, 2014 4:19 a.m.

Nitsho:

The problem with just relying on the police, in this case CHP, reports,
is that nothing really comes to fruition. No follow-ups, no extra patrols, no out reach to the residents regarding concerns of this roadway.

These set of facts are then pretty much compartmented, officials don't see the pattern, accidents are seen as separate occurrences.

This newspaper to help law enforcement agencies can post all the various accidents in the past which happened along this roadway to give readers, officials, some idea of what's been going on here--a historical perspective.

The CHP is a traffic agency, they don't really do community involvement, much less do concentrated patrols in residential areas.

Again, Golden Valley Road is un-incorporated so residents have to contact county officials, to push Sheriff's to do something in the area.

There's already been several accidents (mainly due to speed) on this same stretch of roadway, afterwards everything seems to be forgotten.

At the very least, post a patrol car on Dedre Ln., Samantha Ct. or Cheryl Ln. a few minutes per watch to watch traffic on Golden Valley Road, just to get those speeders to second guess when/if cops are around the corner--around 12am to 3am is when cars are really flying, but it happens throughout the day.

The point is a lot more can be done in the area of prevention when it comes to these types of traffic accidents... A LOT MORE.


bobforte: Posted: August 20, 2014 9:20 a.m.

Very sad about Jennifer. My son goes to school with her and was talking about it when he got home.

Adamtwelve: FYI, a blind curve is a blind curve whether or not you are speeding. This driver could have been doing the speed limit. The article states, "Stift was apparently jogging across Golden Valley Road at Samantha Court....." What does this mean? It sounds to me that she was crossing the street. If this truly is a blind curve, then the driver possibly did not see her whether he was speeding or not.

A tragedy for both. At least he stopped, unlike many who just take off afterwards.

Also, the max speed on any street is 65MPH. Even if it is 50 or 55 here, the driver could legally do above that speed.


Phenics: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:10 p.m.

This is horribly sad and I hope the best for strength for her family; parents in particular. Losing a child is the worst imaginable thing to me and stories like this remind me to give my son love every single day. I am completely disciplined in that effort because it's so important to me. Regarding the area where this happened, we do want to be careful of jumping to conclusions. A couple of facts from what I can tell in looking at the street view of this intersection on my computer: 1). There is no crosswalk and 2). There are no bike lanes. We also know it was pretty dark based on the time it happened. People running on busy roads like this have a responsibility to use caution when stepping off the sidewalk, particularly because of their vulnerability to moving vehicles. This is not an assessment of blame but we also have a young driver involved who has a life ahead of him and grief and guilt to deal with. There's likely blame on both sides in some way which makes this a horrible accident. Keywords being horrible and also, accident. Pedestrians and cyclists always need to be mindful of when vehicles have the right of way. This is a lesson that I will definitely emphasize to my son.


missmarie: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:12 p.m.

From what I know and what I heard, this just seems like an extremely tragic case of being at the wrong place at the wrong time for both of them.
That street has a ridiculously high speed limit, it curves very fast, and it was dark.
I just ask that people think and know the facts before they jump to conclusions.
He could have done, and mostly likely did, nothing "wrong" but, the circumstances around him were out of his control.

I am praying for both families as both of their lives have been changed forever.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:16 p.m.

bobforte:

Sorry, not exactly a blind curve, but rather a type of blind curve because of the incline. If you're going 70 mph plus, you'll never see a pedestrian. Hence speed is crucial here, if you're going slower, you'll be able to react.

Visit the T intersection of Samantha Ct. and Golden Valley Rd. and you will understand, the road plateaus here. As a pedestrian you get a false view and false sense of safety that this particular portion of the road is the safest from which to cross.

Again this is a residential area, even if the county deems it to be a highway, hence 55 mph limit. Either lower the speed limit or place more stop signs to force drivers to reduce speed. Or just police presence for traffic.

Driving 101, the driver has to be more alert than the pedestrian, not the other way around. Again, kids and families walk up and down, cross Golden Valley Rd. It is the driver's responsibility to control his/her speed.

As for 65 mph, when did freeway speed ever become normal in neighborhoods? This should not be acceptable ever.


johnnyrock: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:28 p.m.

RIP sweet angel.


Rocketeer: Posted: August 20, 2014 1:39 p.m.

@bobforte: "the max speed on any street is 65MPH. Even if it is 50 or 55 here, the driver could legally do above that speed."

I'm genuinely curious as to what you mean by that. I thought the posted speed limit determined the max allowable speed for any given street. Is there some quirk of the law with which I am unfamiliar? Five years ago I received a ticket for doing 52 in a 45 on Bouquet. Are you saying I could have fought it?


calnca: Posted: August 20, 2014 3:24 p.m.

The irony Adam12, is that Golden Valley Road, by and large, is only used by the residents of the residential area it serves......it doesn't "go" anywhere. One would think the "residents" of the area in question would "police" themselves.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 20, 2014 4:11 p.m.

Rocketeer: I think he means leeways given by police--police discretion. True. But most leeways given are in freeways, ie. going 75 mph in a 65 mph. But normally their traffic enforcement in residential areas, or just regular side streets, are stricter. And rightly so.

calnca: You are correct to a degree.

Before the latest KB homes at the end of Golden Valley Rd were added, the biggest problem were racers and teenagers who hung out at the end of the street over-looking Wal-Mart. Maybe they were residents of Saugus, but not so much in and around Golden Valley Rd and Plum Canyon, since Holly Dr. was the only made residential hub then.

When Dorothy Street opened up, drivers began using that as a "short-cut", to Camp Plenty Rd, hence more traffic. When the rest of the KB development was completed, more traffic.

So it's not just the residents.

Soon Golden Valley Rd. will be connected to the rest of Golden Valley Rd to Wal-Mart/Sam's club area, more traffic.

So again, more has to be done by way of prevention. At the very start is urban planning, then traffic pattern (speed limits, stop signs, wider side walks, etc.), then its community, police, local gov't officials recognizing problems and offering solutions.



The easiest thing right now, that can be done right now, is traffic enforcement on Golden Valley Rd. police presence and speed enforcement.

It doesn't have to be 24 hours a day/7 days a week, but staggered presence throughout the day, for traffic units and patrol units (in between calls).

Remember, it's kind of hard to "police" ourselves when the speed limit allows for speeding.


bobforte: Posted: August 21, 2014 12:44 a.m.

Rocketeer: Yes, you could have fought it. The deputy or officer who gave you the ticket has to be able to prove that it was unsafe speed that you were doing (i.e.: pedestrians in the area, number of cars on the street, conditions at the time, etc). It is called prima facie, which basically means what I said above. That is the speed for the area, but anything above it must be proven to be unsafe. An officer can actually cite you for going under the speed limit if he thinks your too fast (ie: heavy rain or dense fog). It does happen.

In addition, 22349 of the vehicle code states, "22349. (a) Except as provided in Section 22356, no person may drive a vehicle upon a highway at a speed greater than 65 miles per hour." That is why CHP on the freeway will always cite you for 22349(a), because you are exceeding the max speed, except under 22356, which says that basically some highways have a speed limit of 70MPH, like the 15 freeway. In that case the officer would cite you 22349 when you exceed 70. 22349 does not require the officer to prove anything was unsafe. You exceed the max limit.

Adam Twelve, please don't try to post what I am thinking. YOu are funny though. Not exactly a blind curve but a type of blind curve. Didn't know there were different types. BTW, at what speed must you travel on a blind curve in order to see a pedestrian?



AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 3:35 a.m.

bobforte:

You can technically fight any ticket, including parking tickets, that's why behind the ticket you sign are instructions on how to fight it.

Sometimes, if you're lucky, especially with young, progressive traffic judges, they'll take your side. More times than not, they'll take the officer's side.

But in the case of going above the posted speed limit, a police officer can (usually will) give you a ticket for going over--especially in residential neighborhoods, where "unsafe" is implied, and doesn't have to be "proven".

That's the ticket portion.

It is up to you if you want to fight the ticket and meet with the police officer in court on your appointed date. The police officer will merely have to state that you went over however much the posted speed limit in a residential neighborhood, no need to "prove" anything.

As for the blind curve, it is the incline that restricts vision, hence a type of blind curve, because it restricts vision and is a curve.

At 35 mph, you'll have ample time to react to any pedestrian on the roadway.

Drive up there at night, compare driving at 65 mph (if you happen to get a ticket, you can always fight it) and then drive at 35 mph, there's a big difference in what you can see and your ability to react.



bobforte: Posted: August 21, 2014 11:08 a.m.

Adamtwelve, you may use a cute police name, but you have no idea what you are talking about. The officer MUST prove that the speed was unsafe. --edited.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 11:40 a.m.

bobforte:

Now you're being silly. First you say you can drive around at 65 mph, now you're saying you can fight a speeding ticket by challenging it on grounds on how safe your speeding was.

"Your honor, I was going 65 mph on Plum Canyon, not only because I can, but because it was safe--according to me." Nice.

Just like blowing a stop sign or a stop light needs no further explanation, so is exceeding the posted speed limit. These things are not mere suggestions.

And misinforming others, especially on this article, is frankly not cool.


johnnyrock: Posted: August 21, 2014 1:47 p.m.

Hey people, can we make this post about the sweet child that has passed? It really is sad for the girl killed and for the child who hit her...he has to live with this the rest of his life. I hope he will be okay as well...


Unreal: Posted: August 21, 2014 1:56 p.m.

johnnyrock: You are so right. This about a beautiful girl who had her life ended and another kid who has to live with the images of that night forever.

Laura Bush had an accident where another kid she knew was killed. She missed a stop sign and hit the car. At that time we did not throw kids in jail for accidents. She went on to become a lovely woman and lead a very productive and happy life. I wish the same for this boy.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 1:57 p.m.

johnnyrock:

We can all give our condolences but if we don't convert these tragedies into something tangible, then their deaths will all be in vain. There's a growing list of traffic accidents in Santa Clarita, both vehicle on vehicle and vehicle on ped and vehicle on bike, resulting in not just deaths but life changing injuries. Convert all this into something that will alleviate more accidents, that should be the discussion.


Unreal: Posted: August 21, 2014 2:14 p.m.

The "discussion" on this story should be about the girl who lost her life.
The entire story is about her and the type of person she was.

If you want to rant about traffic issues send a letter to the editor and vent. So far there are no accusations the driver was speeding.


bobforte: Posted: August 21, 2014 3:21 p.m.

Thank you unreal. Some people believe it is speed related.

Adamtwelve thinks he knows the law. Why don't you ask some officers or deputies and they will tell you I am right. The best thing is just to admit you are wrong and then we can stop this. I know what I am talking about.

But here it is also from the CA driver's handbook:

Speed Limits
California has a “Basic Speed Law.”
This law means that you may never
drive faster than is safe for current
conditions. For example, if you are
driving 45 mph in a 55 mph speed
zone during a dense fog, you could
be cited for driving “too fast for
conditions.”
Regardless of the posted speed limit,
your speed should depend on:
• The number and speed of other
vehicles on the road.
• Whether the road surface is
smooth, rough, graveled, wet,
dry, wide, or narrow.
• Bicyclists or pedestrians walking
on the road’s edge or crossing the
street.
• Whether it is raining, foggy,
snowing, windy, or dusty.
Maximum Speed Limit
The maximum speed limit on most
California highways is 65 mph. You
may drive 70 mph where posted.
Unless otherwise posted, the maximum
speed limit is 55 mph on twolane
undivided highways and for
vehicles towing trailers. --edited.


bobforte: Posted: August 21, 2014 3:31 p.m.

Funny is that it is adamtwelve that derailed the thread.


Unreal: Posted: August 21, 2014 4:47 p.m.

It sounds like she was a wonderful girl. The story says she made "faces" to make people laugh, and always seemed to lift the moods of those around her. She sounded like a natural leader and SCV really lost someone special.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 6:08 p.m.

bobforte:

You are wrong. The danger in what you're saying here is that you are encouraging speeding, somehow justifying it.

When you go over, say a 50 mph posted speed limit, you've already violated the code. The police officer is the witness of said violation. The ticket is issued for the infraction. You're given a choice to pay the fine or challenge it.

The traffic court system is there to hear out your side if you chose to fight the ticket, it's not there to hear out the officer's side, hence the burden of proof is on you and not the officer. The officer shows up in court to counter whatever defense or excuse you decide to use--

you can say you drove 10 mph over the 50 mph posted limit, because it was 4am and the road was empty, or you were late for work, whatever. That's an excuse, you still violated the posted speed limit (from which you got the ticket) it is still up to the judge to either give you a break or side with the officer, which usually happens.

You can even question the officer's radar gun, but the officer only needs to testify that he observed you going so and so speed over the posted speed limit. Sure, he can add that accidents have happened on that same very road way at the same time, or that there were in fact other people or vehicles in the area, but

technically, all the officer needs to say is that you went over the posted speed limit, hence the ticket. The judge can ask the officer if there were cars or people around at the time of violation, and the officer can say no, and

the judge can still uphold the violation.

So where ever you're getting this info from, that violations of posted signs are somehow suggestions only, it is just patently wrong. If you're offended, I am genuinely sorry, but it is just wrong.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 6:14 p.m.

Unreal:

Along with other residents, we have written the Signal, SCV Sheriffs, CHP, county and city officials. Unlike other serious crimes, like murder or ADW, the CHP didn't really canvas the area for witnesses. But just from talking to neighbors on Golden Valley Rd and Holly Dr, there is no doubt in anyone's minds that speed was a big factor.


bobforte: Posted: August 21, 2014 8:25 p.m.

Adam, trust me, you are wrong. You do not know what you are talking about. Unfortunately this story will fall off the main page soon and I will not comment.

I guess printing out the law for you and showing you the driver's handbook is not enough to show you are wrong. I am not justifying speeding.

I really encourage you to go to traffic court and watch several cases. You will then realize I am right and you are wrong.

What it sounds like is you are bitter toward LEOs are you couldn't make it as one, that is why you use a cute little name like you have. You criticize the CHP now for not looking for witnesses. I work with CHP officers and know for a fact they do some of the best work on traffics, especially when it come to K injury collisions.

I had to look at a map, but I don't see any homes on Golden Valley Road in that area. What neighbors do you have on Golden Valley Road. Again, something you are making up.

Who did you write to at LASD and CHP. And why would you write the city officials? You said yourself earlier its and unincorporated area. Don't you know what that means? It means you are not part of the city of Santa Clarita so city officials will do nothing for you. Good try though. Remember what you put in previous posts.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 21, 2014 8:54 p.m.

bobforte:

I just gave you a step by step on how wrong you are, and you only posted some cut and paste on the basic speed law from the DMV not even related to what we are talking about. And you ask me to trust you, I already know you are patently WRONG! If you can't make your point, I can't do it for you--you don't get to say "Trust me".

Again, the burden of proof if you chose to challenge the ticket is on you, you've already been found in violation of said infraction by the police officer, when you were observed going over the posted speed limit.

As for being bitter towards police, how did you surmise that? You are correct that it is an un-incorporated area, hence the difficulty on getting things done, if anything that is where the bitterness is expressed, not the police.

Does CHP generally canvas the area for witnesses in these types of investigations? We both know they don't, it's a traffic case, and they are a traffic agency, but had it been any other violent crime, the standard operating procedure would be canvas the area, the bigger the better, the more people you talk to the better.

That's not an attack on the CHP, just statement of fact. They are not patrol.

We residents contacted City officials, because our nearest Sheriffs station is Acton, which services the un-incorporated portions of SC Valley, by contacting city officials we request that the city field some units to this area to supplement Acton units, which is just 1 to 2 cars for this area.

As for Golden Valley Rd., the issue had always been that this portion of the road is somehow deemed a highway because of lack of homes, because homes don't face Golden Valley Rd., their backyards do, or in the case of 4 homes the side of their yards.

Can you imagine having a backyard that's adjacent to a "highway" with cars consistently flying by at 80 mph? What do you deduce will happen if cars go out of control? There's no homes that face Golden Valley (as already described above), but it is a de facto residential area, because kids, families, people walk up and down this road, cross this road, use this road.

And you're saying it's legal to go 65 mph. Absurd!

Again, instead of googling take some time to drive up the road.



bobforte: Posted: August 22, 2014 1:01 a.m.

Adam, you mean to tell me, you saw that the CHP checked for no witnesses when someone got killed? Really?

You don't even know that the city council does not represent your area. Your hole keeps getting deeper.

Now cars are flying on Golden Valley, huh? At 80 MPH? You just keep increasing the speed don't you?

You residents contacted city officials, huh? Again, you don't live in the city. They don't care to hear from you. You live in unincorporated area. The board of supervisors is who you want to talk to.

Also, there is no SHeriff's station in Acton. SCV Sheriff's handle your area. You really are funny. Anyways, the Palmdale station handles Acton.

You are showing more and more that you don't know what you are talking about. Are you sure you even live in that area on Golden Valley Road? In the world where cars fly.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 22, 2014 1:51 a.m.

bobforte:

What happened? No more discussion on your constitutional right to drive 65 mph anywhere? Figures.

CHP did ask the homes on Samantha Ct, but failed to talk to the ones on Holly and on Christopher, who would've heard the speeding car.

Read my earlier comments, bob, I've noted excessive speeds before, not just now, flying at 80 mph is pretty consistent on Golden Valley Rd.

Again, we've contacted both county and city, both of whom have been unresponsive, hence the problem with this road. We've repeatedly ask for the speed limit to be brought down to 35 or 40 mph, and have it enforced, and

the answer is pretty much that Golden Valley Rd. is not residential.

There is a substation at Acton, who we were told handles our area and that with only 1 or 2 cars devoted, they really can't promise much. We then asked SCV Sheriffs for extra patrol, a few years back, before the new captain, and we were told to contact city officials regarding this request.

Why are you being so dismissive of the problem on Golden Valley Rd.

The series of accidents, complaints, and numerous attempts to get something done, have been met with similar skepticism, and on Monday a girl died.

This isn't something to be mocked.

We are trying to get something done here. I hope to god you're not part of the SCV local gov't, although your level of callousness seems familiar.


bobforte: Posted: August 22, 2014 10:17 a.m.

ADam, just answer the question as to why you would contact city officials. You don't live in the city.

In regards to the Acton substation, they DO NOT handle that area. They would not cross boundaries to come into SCV.

I am not being dismissive of the problems of GV. But your information is not all true. Don't provide false information. Now you are saying the CHP did some canvassing, but not on your street. You are assuming again it was speed. Why would they come and ask if you heard it? Why don't you just come out and tell them. Do you need the number to the CHP on THe Old Road? Or are you going to write them? I live off Copperhill where we have our share of fair accidents. At one point Copperhill was both county and city depending on the side of the street. If I heard an accident outside, then I went out first to check on the welfare of the people involved. And two, to provide any information I could provide to the CHP or Sheriff depending on who was handling the incident.

Now in your last post, you say you asked SCV Sheriff's for help. I thought the Palmdale station was helping you. Because that is who handles Acton.

Make up your mind. Get your facts straight. Then come back and post here. And in your final sentence, you mention the SCV local government. Why do you? YOU DO NOT LIVE IN THE CITY!!!! THE CITY CAN NOT DO ANYTHING FOR YOU!!!! Don't you get it?


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 22, 2014 12:18 p.m.

bobforte:

I don't think you're reading my comments. I just explained why we contacted city officials--to ask for them to have SCV Sheriffs to field some cars to Golden Valley Rd. area, because we were told by SCV Sheriffs to contact them (that was before this new captain). We are in contact with all parties now, only they are pushing the buck in circles.

Read what I'm writing, no intelligent discussion can happen if you don't read.

SCV Sheriffs informed us early on that as an un-incorporated area, Acton substation handles our area, and since Acton handles our area, we have to ask, by special request, from the city of SC for SCV Sheriffs patrol cars.

As for neighbors who heard of the speeding, because they only heard and not see, they are not too keen on doing anything. And they were not asked by CHP, which they don't for these "accidents", they don't canvas a big area, their focus is measurements.

Also the folks who heard the speeding did not necessarily hear the impact uphill (although some did) because they lived on Christopher and on Holly, they heard the emergency units a few minutes afterwards. And again, because it was auditory and not visually, they did not see themselves as witnesses.

Again, bob, you are not reading.

We contacted Acton substation, because SCV Sheriffs told us they handle our area, Acton substation diplomatically explained that they couldn't possibly significantly cover our area, and that SCV Sheriffs can greatly help. Because it was un-incorporated, SCV Sheriffs ask residents to contact the city gov't to make a special request for extra patrol, since we are not part of the city (they say they are doing extra patrols here, but none of us have seen actual presence, ie, radar gun enforcement, they do on other major highways in SC.

Does that explain (for the 3rd time now) why we've contacted SCV Sheriffs, Acton substation, CHP, county & city gov't? Read. I've explained all this, this the 3rd time now.


bobforte: Posted: August 22, 2014 4:24 p.m.

Oh geez. You realize how LASD works out here, correct?

Some Sheriff's are assigned to the city while the others are assigned to the unincorporated areas. The city, which you are not a part of, contracts with LASD to have "x" amount of deputies on duty at all times. LASD and the county then decide how many to have on duty in the unincorporated areas. Now in emergencies, help calls, backups, etc, they will respond to each other.

So your calls to city officials fell of deaf ears. The city will not tell LASD to send extra patrol to your area.

BTW, where is this Acton substation anyways? Address please. Look at the boundary maps on LASD website and you will see there is no way the Palmdale area serves your area.

So now you say people didn't hear the collision. If that is the case, then why would CHP contact them? Let me get you a bigger shovel.


missyJk: Posted: August 22, 2014 4:39 p.m.

@AdamTwelve go stand outside walmart with a petition dont use this forum for your own agenda...Bobforte is correct and in ADDITION speed limits are determined by doing speed tests of random cars be careful they may raise it to 60 if what you say people do much more than the 55...it's a tragic accident and those things to happen and if you are in an unicorporated area means you're not getting hit with all our city issues, than petition outside walmart to become part of the city and welcome to the world of taxes in our city


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 22, 2014 4:58 p.m.

bobforte:

As per SCV Sheriffs, we were informed that Acton Sheriffs handles the un-incorporated portion of Golden Valley Rd area from Plum Canyon. We were given their contact info. Acton Sheriffs, seemed to have no qualms on this jurisdictional issue, only that they were limited on man power, hence to contact SCV Sheriffs, who later referred us to city gov't.

Now if what you're saying is true, then someone at SCV Sheriffs has lead us astray either on purpose or by way of ignorance.

The calls for extra patrol on GV Road did not fall on deaf ears, since our complaints were in fact entertained, only that nothing of significance by way of extra traffic enforcement ever materialized.

Our request for reduction of speed limit have also been on pause. Right now we are at a stalemate with county gov't, so if you can offer any sort of advice on this, since you seem to be part of local gov't here, that would be much appreciated rather than apathy.

If you are part of local gov't please help, there have been way too much accidents here, and there will be more unless anything's done.

I've never been to the Acton substation, our contact have been telephonic only. Not by me personally but by others more active in this push for more traffic enforcement and reduction of speed limit. But I have been in contact with certain deputies at the SCV Sheriffs station.

bob, it wasn't a vehicle on vehicle collision, it was a vehicle on ped collision, hence less sound. As for CHP contacting them, witnesses who only heard the speeding would not have been of any use to the CHP since their investigation focuses on measurements, rather than sounds, circumstantial evidence, etc. which would be the focus of say more violent crimes--door knock and canvas as many homes surrounding said incident as possible.

Again, if you are in fact part of local gov't, SCV Sheriffs, then help us out here, don't ridicule what we are trying to do, this girl who died, I'm sure I've seen her run up and down GV Rd before, since I run up here regularly, as do many kids and families, We are trying to make this roadway safer.

Don't knock what we are doing please. If you are in the know, help out.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 22, 2014 5:03 p.m.

missyjk:

bobforte, engaged me in a tit for tat and I obliged him. Hopefully he's part of local gov't, since he seems to be in the know--although his knowledge of the vehicle code & traffic court system is superficial.

We have a petition which is underway for this area, no need for Walmart, since this is more of an HOA process.

There's the long game (speed tests, etc. which we've already requested) and there's a short game here, short game being traffic enforcement now.


bobforte: Posted: August 22, 2014 6:36 p.m.

THANK YOU missyJK. Maybe Adam can follow up at the Acton "substation". Still waiting for that address of where it is located.

He/She is a work of art. Thanks for agreeing with me on the speed issue. Anyone with half a brain could google the info and see I am right.

As this story will fall off the main page soon, and I don't go into the archives, RIP Jennifer.


bobforte: Posted: August 22, 2014 6:36 p.m.

Adam, what is the address where I can come sign the petition?


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 22, 2014 6:53 p.m.

bobforte:

How have you proven your point that going 65mph on a 50mph speed limit is actually OK? You haven't. There's basic speed (the one you cut & paste) and absolute speed limits, a post speed limit is considered absolute!!! JesusChrist!

If you're part of the HOA here, you would've gotten the chance to sign the petition, by mail, otherwise, I don't believe the petition is open to the public. Only residents can applying inclusion to the city.

I hope to god, you aren't the guy giving us the run around in SCV Sheriffs station. As for the Acton substation google it. If you are a deputy (or just play one on TV) you should know.


bobforte: Posted: August 24, 2014 1:07 p.m.

Well I went to the archives, just to prove how uninformed you really are.

1) I did Google Acton Substation. Can't find it. Please provide address.

2) California is a basic speed law state, not an absolute speed limit state. Back to police science class for you.

3) Does you HOA cover Golden Valley Road? What good is your HOA going to do? You have a lot to learn.


AdamTwelve: Posted: August 25, 2014 1:06 a.m.

1). Santiago Rd and Sierra Hwy, Acton.

2). Nope CA is a presumed speed state, not Basic. Which means they presumed your going over the speed limited posted is unsafe, hence your burden of proof to prove yourself going over a post speed limit is IN FACT safe--very hard to prove. You might be lucky with a nice judge at traffic court, unlikely.

3). Several HOA vote to be included in the city of SC.

You can't seem to get me, no matter how hard you try, bob, which could only mean I am right and you are wrong.



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